Mental Health Awareness Month #UnlockLoneliness Part 2 with MS Counseling Alumna Marnee Weisbrod

0:08Hello. Recording in progress. Alright. As Natalia did mention a minute ago, she is a, she is a a Divine Mercy University grad, the class of '21, and she has been in counseling ever since. She she dove straight into the field, before we even got married, and basically right now has been run working kind of as in a part time, ever since we really started our family together. And she predominantly works through telehealth, from home, which is not counseling. Both of us we both actually have the grace of working from home. So I work mornings in the the the coaching and consulting world and also help take care of our our little ones. While I'm studying, for DMU, just coming to the completion of my first year of, the mental health school counseling, studies.

1:06Getting ready for residency number two. For any of my classmates who were out there, I hope you're enjoying week two of our, whatever this is, like, mid spring break. So diving in a little bit into first off, give you a little snapshot of my wife. Okay? DMU, Brad, oldest of nine. Alright? Theologian, studied at the Sacred Heart Seminary in up here in Michigan. This is where we live. We live in a little city called Grand Blanc, Michigan. And last year, we started a joint, counseling and coaching business together. She kicked off her own, basically, Genesis Counseling, works together with with Crux Leadership Coaching. She takes all the counseling parts, and I take the the coaching parts. And we are in the midst of taking on new clinicians.

1:59So any of you, any any of you Catholic clinicians out there in Michigan who are looking for a good place to join up with, give us a shout. And we're growing it up here in in the state of Michigan. We're now taking on a few. We have already three more clinicians who are in process. Another another big highlight for her has been that over the the course of this past year as she was kicking off her own practice, together with a fellow alumni of, of DMU, Jody Pitcher, who they are dear friends and have been since they were studying together, starting up in 2018 or 2019 from their one of their first, residencies together. They decided last year, last April, to to write a book together, and it's titled Conversations for the Modern Catholic Woman.

2:49If you're interested, they published it last month, and, you can find it on Amazon. You know? And, hopefully, there's a link somewhere you can go to search her name, Martie Weisbrod, or that title, and feel free to to dive in. A lot of it has come from her and Jody's personal experience in the clinical world, especially, dealing with women. Right? They predominantly, Marnie has focused over these past years as a counselor in, with women, and with women both in high school and college age have been a large portion of her, of her clients, that she's taken care of. So a little bit you know, I'll try to get past the intros here, but a little bit of why me. Alright? Why did she ask me to fill in and not somebody who's already an alum?

3:45As Natalia mentioned at the beginning, you know, number one, I have the grace of being Marnie's husband. So it was kind of an easy pass for, you know, to happen inside of the family here. On second point, I have the blessing of having been a former religious priest, and have worked with hundreds of men and women of all ages, both in spiritual and life matters while it's both while in ministry and in a professional capacity as a life coach with leadership and management trainer. I was engaged in education as an educator for fifteen years and have a master's in educational leadership from Notre Dame. Thank you, Natalia, for the shout out to go Irish. And, last year, following a great course, probably out for three or four years of discernment, I finally decided to jump into DMU for the, for the clinical mental health masters, to really deepen the level of service that I can offer and bring the talents and gifts that God's given me and the experiences through the years, into helping others in the journey of healing and flourishing.

4:51For anybody who's in my class, I'm gonna put the APA bits at all twenty twenty, healing and flourishing. That's what we're kind of all about. Right? But enough about us. Let's dive in. I wanna share with you actually, I probably should have shared already. This is our theme of loneliness, and especially diving in with loneliness that students may experience. Loneliness and the lack of social connection, and relationship and its impact on the physical and mental health, and the stigma around acknowledging loneliness. This is our theme for tonight. This we're gonna dive into, because, unfortunately, in many ways, loneliness goes hidden. It's it's there is a stigma around it. It's hard for, especially our young people, high school student age, to to dive into a theme like this, to share that they're lonely, especially, at school, among their peers, among their families at times, depending on the situations.

5:53And it they oftentimes will come to us in a counseling capacity or even in a coaching capacity, to ask for help, to seek help, to look looking and longing for a way to, to dive through. You know, this is where it's actually been an interesting experience for me in going from the coaching world to the counseling world where, the coaching part has been much more on the practical side in many ways, where, making a very clear distinction between the two, the counseling world very much is a world of healing and flourishing, trying to bring fullness back to the life of the person and try to get past whatever stigmas, whatever, shame or or or voices that they may have inside of themselves or outside of themselves Diving into the idea or the theme, breaking into high school students, some college students.

6:56There's a lot of clients that we've seen in both, both of us, that are in this demographic and looking at at at loneliness in particular, in high school. Alright? I'm gonna go through some of the the the notes that Marnie has prepared, especially coming from a clinical point of view. We're looking at mental health awareness month, and in particular, wanting to come from a predominantly a perspective from a, a clinician, a therapist who who is doing the deep dive, time after time with numerous individuals and trying to help them along their path. High school students. Let's go. Loneliness affects students. Their experience is really one that, well, I'll I'll just share that tonight's in particular, our our our subject.

7:53We're gonna dive much it's gonna be more practical or clinical much more than it is going to be research focused. Right? One thing that that we love about counseling is that you get into the story of each individual. Alright? Sometimes data might be might kind of get in the way. It's important for us as students, I realize that already, to be kind of immersing ourselves in all the data points. But having that as kind of the backdrop or the canvas to be able to work with, so that when we get into the into the into the the the therapeutic relationship, we're able to get into the story of each individual. You know? And I think that that helps inform the questions like loneliness and mental health questions.

8:37You get to know the why this person is experiencing this or that, happening and how they're experiencing it and what are the things that work for them and help them improve. I find the experience is so much more helpful and interesting and well rounded, so that's where we're gonna draw from tonight. For high school students, I've noticed that one of the contributors to loneliness is that peers are perceived as doing well. It's kind of a that's a highlight point there. There's gonna be a number of different highlight points I'll I'll bring out for you tonight. Peers are perceived as doing well, especially we're talking about high school kids. Right? It's kind of a general statement. When high school students look around, generally, they perceive that their friends or their classmates, everyone seems to be doing great, and I'm the only one that's not.

9:31I don't feel like I can share what I'm going through. I don't feel like I can kind of break that barrier. People's perception of me will be so shaken because it seems that nobody else is going through whatever it is that I'm going through. So it's it's a it's very lonely to go through mental health challenges, especially as a as a high school student. Additionally, there's if there is enough courage to share what's going on with your friends, as well meaning as they may be, their peers are not going to be emotionally mature enough to really know how to support and empathize well. And they may try and some may make strides in that direction, but, generally, they're they're going through their own things.

10:19There's a sort of just natural developmentally self centeredness, around that time of life, and everyone's focused on themselves and what they're going through. Let me just Natalia, can you jump ahead a couple actually, you know what? I'm gonna share my screen real quick. It's very difficult to break out of this, kinda self centeredness for for high school students. Okay? It's very difficult for them to break out of it, and say to their friend, you know, I'm so sorry. How can I support you? What do you need? To kinda be able to take that on and and walk with someone else in their emotional mental burden, it's very hard for for a young person to be able to do. Another reason why sharing or breaking out of of this isolation is is very challenging is that teenage students don't have the emotional and mental awareness or or vocab to to express it.

11:22Maybe a student desires to share something they're going through, but it just they don't even know how to get it out. They don't have the words. They don't have the vocabulary to be able to enunciate and explain themselves. There is an awareness that is that something is off inside. We might know we don't feel well mentally, emotionally, but we have no idea how to put that into words or or share. Okay. Natalia, can you let me know if you're actually seeing the, the slides? Yes. High school students. Are you still seeing them? Because I have this thing that says it's paused. I see the high school students one. Perfect. Okay. Excellent. Thank you. Mhmm. So, yes, they have they have an internal awareness that something is off.

12:20Alright? They have no idea really how to put it into words or to share it with their friends or family. And so not being able to share it, you know, and not being able to express or explain it, oftentimes, this creates more of an isolation and a feeling like they they simply can't share what's going on inside of them. They're kind of locked in, a restriction, because those sharing options kinda feel closed. You know, they feel awkward speaking to their parents about it, or, they feel awkward in sharing it out with with their friends who may have a difficulty with it themselves or who are carrying their own, their own experiences also. For those who actually do share and and and have a relationship enough with their parents to be able to share, let's say their parents are interested, okay, and they're supported, which, let's be honest, is not all parents.

13:18But let's say, you know, for for our discussion today, let's say they are very involved. Parents and high school students try to break through. They have to kinda create their vocabulary because there's a barrier between them. But then the student just often does not like what their parents have to say in response. Right? Their parents may not, may not even have the the vocabulary or really the the the thoughts created or or developed in themselves on on how to approach different scenarios. You know? And so the the kids themselves may not like what their parents are saying or may take it offensive. There's also an element of that's not necessarily they don't want to be told what to do. Okay?

14:07And look or or necessarily looking for advice. They want empathy. They want support. But their parents may not be well versed in in how to give this, or there may be other complications in the parent child relationship as the kids start getting closer to independence and adulthood. There's often tensions present, and so these conversations may not go too well. And that can also be a barrier, create barriers perceived by by the student, by the client. So just just sharing what they're going through. Darren, sorry to interrupt really quick. The wording is cut off on the right hand side. There we go. Perfect. You liking that? Yes. Okay. I'm gonna move to college kids now. Tell me I'm gonna I'm gonna watch my own screen over here.

14:58Can you still see everything okay on your side? Yes. We're good. Fantastic. College students. Alright. Taking our discussion a little bit to the to the next level, the next age bracket. College students, oftentimes experience the same things or many of the same things that we just talked about a minute ago, also apply to them. They're not much older, but there are some differences that come up. For instance, college students may have a a very hard, or they may have had a a familiar excuse me, a very familiar community that they're coming from, their high school or their school, their their hometown, surrounded by people that they grew up with, and they're they're still living at home with their family.

15:50Then suddenly college comes. They're away from it all. And in many ways, they're starting from scratch, okay, which maybe they've never had to do, at all in their entire life. It's not uncommon these days, that they find themselves in a new location, in a new living situation, having to make friends, forced in with, with roommates or people that they had no no foreknowledge of before they arrived to campus. Right? It's very daunting, especially for anyone who has any tiny bit of natural introversion. It can even be more challenging to try to courageously reach out and create community that one needs for support. Okay. There can also be that sense that, again, everyone else is thriving in college, all the peers.

16:47Okay? Or maybe some of them, seem like they're doing great. They're exploring things or they they've been in an environment for a year or two, and they they seem to be doing really well. So, again, there's there's gonna be this external perception that everybody else is figuring it out and they're making friends. They found their people. You know, they don't they're doing well in classes. Why am I not doing well? Will be a question they'll ask. I don't want people to know that I'm not doing well, but I'm struggling. So I'm gonna pretend that I'm doing well and that I'm okay. Everything's okay. Or people will think that I'm weird or that I'm weak or that I'm needy. Alright? There's still some maturity limitations at this time as well, of course.

17:37They're still developing, but, but are usually farther along than high school students are in their maturity. They can be a little more empathy, a little more understanding, when you get to college. And people are starting to begin to work through some of their emotional struggles. So there can be greater levels of empathy and interest. Alright? It happens all the time, and a lot of their their friend groups may actually may, come from different conversations or different experiences shared, like these. Naturally takes time to make new friends, alright, and to build a new community. And it's it's important to recognize that this is normal for them. Alright? That it could take a whole semester, a whole first year sometimes, especially for quieter students.

18:23It feels like it's something that should happen immediately. And if it doesn't happen immediately, there can be this self perception that something's wrong with me, and that I can it can be a very debilitating perception. These thoughts make a person want to isolate even more, which can undermine their confidence for going out and connecting, during this phase of life. Alright? There are often so many different new things. We've already mentioned a handful of them. But, like, also, you know, new dating relationships, whether the person has dated previously in high school or never dated ever, new ground to navigate in new situations, parties, that are made up entirely of peers at other people's houses or different types of dances and social events.

19:11All of it's new. And for anybody who's who's battling or struggling in any of these areas of loneliness, you know, these are not necessarily gonna be big answers for them. Alright? These new experiences, it it actually may cause them, as we mentioned earlier, to isolate even more. One of the key things that we've noticed also is that, there's there are different types of morals that, that the client or the these these students may suddenly experience, especially if they grew up in a tight knit family or community, that's centered around faith and ethics. Right? All these new things take time to get used to and may involve making mistakes, which is challenging for some of them. Alright? If students deal with scrupulosity or, shaming family or friends, the mistakes can compound their desire to hide, to disconnect, or for an internal shaming critic, you know, to build up.

20:16Additionally, being away from family can sometimes bring to light, different things about their family life growing up that were not so great or maybe cause damage. So they're complicated and maybe close the close connection with family changes. Maybe even those familiar relationships are no longer familiar, but they require a whole new approach. Again, if previously family was the way to come out of isolation or a lifeline of sorts, that may not be there in the same way that the student as the student goes to college and their perception, of things shifts. For many, if you no longer feel like you have a close connection to family, it can cause them to feel like, what do I have? Who do I have to reach out to?

21:05Who is my support system? So here's where we come in, kind of in the counseling world and, you know, offering a couple different suggestions on ways to help. Let me switch my next slide. Ways to help. In all these areas as a counselor, we do we do a lot of listening. We're listening, you know, like I said, for their story. What is this person's story, the whole story? So that you you know as much as as you can to really understand this person's experiences. You know, in the midst of that story, in the midst of that listening, we we move to validate. We validate because given the information we've just gone over, we know that so many of these experiences are normal that they're going through.

22:05And there definitely are these our clients, these students are not alone. It's very hard to perceive it. But I know with clients in these different age groups, it's very they need our type of validation. Right? They need to be validated. They need to know that what they're going through, is something that's common, that's normal. It's not a sign of weakness. It's not a sign of weirdness. And it's common. It was been a lot of time trying to help them understand that what they're expressing to to us, is expressed, is expressed to us by many other individuals of their same age in their same positions. And they don't know that others around them or what their others are going through, because it may not be talked about very much.

23:01So as a suggestion, try to validate what they're feeling or validate that what they are feeling does not make them unusual or singled out or that there's something exceptionally wrong with them. It can also help to encourage them to share and ask questions of their peers to affirm that others have their struggles too. A second point is going to be that of helping form an emotional vocabulary. That's a big part of the work as well. I let them know that they're what they're experiencing, that they're experiencing things that they don't understand, and they don't know how to articulate. And it it doesn't just happen overnight that you learn how to do those things. Together, we explore feelings.

23:48We explore variations of emotions and and create words for them or find the words for them to define them. We try to get very specific on what they're feeling. You know? Is it anger? You know? And if it is, well, what if we look at some different names for anger? Is it actually frustration? Is it irritation? Is it disappointment or sadness? Building their emotional vocabulary and helping them to develop their psychoeducation, what they're going through is super important. You know, helping them understand how does anxiety work, how does depression work, OCD, etcetera, And how that produces certain emotional behavioral responses, kind of like the CBT work, event, emotion, thoughts, body experience.

24:38You know, how certain experiences mentally, emotionally, physically lead to their their mental, emotional, and physical counterparts, and how to recognize them. If it's possible, another point is that of, if it's possible to have a positive relationship with their parents, you know, if those determining, discovering if those relationships are healthy or stable enough for this, and wouldn't cause further harm. Alright? And if they are healthy enough, then definitely trying to encourage and foster those relationships is going to be a helpful tool. Usually, it's parents who have signed their kids up for therapy, at least in high school, sometimes in college too. So we know the the parents care.

25:28We have to kinda find out from the client what that relationship looks like and how safe it is. But, generally, that's pretty safe, and we can try to encourage students to have their parents be some of their first go tos because, you know, parents are the longest term relationships that they've had and, hopefully, the most stable relationships that they have and, also, the relationship with the with the most resources to help them. Another point is then moving on to once you have those, sharing with peers. It's beneficial. Peers don't necessarily know how to respond to some of the challenging situations, as we've mentioned earlier. May also give advice skewed by their ever growing experience as well.

26:15But having support from fears is still still important in the sense that it removes stigma from the clients. For them to be able to share what they're going through, it's not necessarily that they're leaning upon them, as their main go tos, but the fact that they can actually share parts of what they're going through begins to remove that stigma, from their life. You know? And they get to be recognized for who they are and brings normalcy to it. Darren, sorry to interrupt. It's cut off again on the right hand side. Oh, okay. Let me see if I can do something. There we go. Perfect. Thank you. How was that? Still good? So another big point is actually gonna be that of exploring their spiritual life and their relationship with god.

27:07Alright? Sometimes it's not very well formed for younger adolescents. We might not know exactly, what their relationship with god is, or maybe that it's just it's just still developing. But for instance, if they know that they have a fairly negative perception based on things that they've experienced, then it has to be unpacked at some point. And if their relationship with God is affected by their relationship with their parents, all of that is part of what we're gonna go through. So so to help bring, bring resolution and bring healing to all of that. One point that's interesting is that of self disclosure. I know that, generally, as counselors, as a rule, we don't self disclose very much and very often.

27:59Okay? This session is about the client and not about me. But my but our experiences, with younger clients and maybe with young adults as well, I find that it's often it they often receive validation effectively through some intentional self disclosure. Okay? It's one thing to say so many of your peers, you know, are going through the same things you are. I just know they are. I see clients with this all the time or something like that, you know, these different kind of cliche lines. It's another thing to say, wow. Yeah. I remember when I was around 15 or 16, and this is how I felt. This is how I interacted in those situations. You're not going overboard. Okay? It's not too much information.

28:54It's just to let them know that's that something that an adult professional who's invested in them went through and made their way through it and is now on the other side. Another point is that of age specific resources. There are definitely times when I offer resource resources, especially for, for kids this age or for young people this age, resources such as workbooks or perhaps reading material, if they're old enough. There, it's really a question of if they're old enough to be able to appreciate it. But sometimes, I'll pull in little YouTube videos or clips, or just resources that I know sort of speak to their specific need for the age that they're in. Sometimes the audio visual resources get their attention in a different way, a better way.

29:48It kind of pierces through in a different way. So if you can find a three minute video that simply walks through, for instance, loneliness, what we're talking about tonight. You know, speaking to a teenager, then sometimes, they can be more attention getting than just your talk experience with them. Loneliness and a lack of social connections in relationship. This is one I think there are a number of places to kind of reference the importance of these connections in relationships. So here I have, you know, the CCMMP in all of its glory. Alright? My wife tells me the story of when she was studying at DMU. I think the CCMMP was still underway. She graduated in '21 and maybe it had just, you know, bits at all twenty twenty.

30:46We know that it was it was finalized then, but I don't think the the students really got their hands on it until the close of her year, and how they would basically just have a handful of of digital PDFs. Now being able to dive into that piece, the CCMMP, and being able to share some of the the deep nuggets that are inside of it with our with our our our clients about, their value, about their dignity is going to be super important. Right? The fact that we actually take it, we can we can consume it and assimilate it so that it really influences the way that we look at them. We look at them in their fullness, not in their brokenness. It really is it's something that's very life giving. You know?

31:38Breaking up the buy the bible and taking a look and seeing man and his brokenness and being able to share this with our with with some of our clients, you know, especially if we have kind of a religious focus already in our in our work, and they realize who we are, alright, as, as perhaps Catholic counselors, depending on how your what the relationship is there. And being able to pull from, different different readings, different scripture passages is going to be something that's gonna be super helpful, for each one as we're going down the road. You know, one of the things that kinda comes to mind in in the midst of all of this, especially when it comes to loneliness and a lack of social connection and relationships, COVID.

32:26One thing that is impacting our our society so much, and the clientele that we're that we're dealing with is that COVID created a social isolation that so many people have, experienced in a deep manner. I don't know what everybody else what their personal experiences of it were, But to be able to cut through that and actually start creating, more connection, a stronger correlation or stronger relationships with people, it's it's it's life changing. You know, for instance, you know, some of the recommended practices to help people break through that, those who are struggling with depression, those who are struggling in some of the different, areas of isolation, depression, other types of mind trap experiences, often trying to engage in activities that that focus on other people.

33:33Alright? And trying to recreate those positive relationships outside of oneself. I know it's a type of approach that's encouraged in, in AA and in treating addictions. We see all the all the time how relationships where clients feel when they feel loved and known and cared for, it helps to to counteract negative beliefs about self. Alright? One of the big questions, a stigma around, acknowledging loneliness, maybe similar to the stigma around mental health in general. Right? And we know that a lot that is shifting in the culture, especially post COVID and our various social media influencers. But thinking about some of the deeper messages in our culture, we know that there is an emphasis on independence, which can, in some cases, work against the communal or community oriented mindset.

34:34And it says being a part of a community is normal and needed and healthy and even essential for life. Women and men in different ways have messages about needing to be able to manage everything again on their own and not to let others know that, you know, when when things are too much or that there's a great need or there's a need for helping support, that can be seen as a person not being able to handle what the culture expects them to handle. Okay? It's not exactly a stigma, but I think, about about how it's kind of the norm to be moving, you know, nowadays, and living away from families of origin. And therefore, it takes away maybe part of the community of a childhood of of one's childhood.

35:27And there's this idea that we we don't need that in order to live well. And if we do find that, we need we need that to some extent. We don't have, to go for our own efforts. We're gonna try to create that in our new locations, and that's not always easy or quick, and does take certain acknowledgment of need. Then there's also, the global Internet community. This is kind of a double edged sword. Masquerades is being, you know, people being very connected with so many people and at the same at all times and at day and night. But it doesn't really fill the need for relationships, that can that counteract isolation. You may you may be in the isolation of your own room connecting with people virtually, but you're still by yourself.

36:22And some part of us knows, knows that. Some part of us just needs to be around other people. To encourage people to encourage our our our clients including including these these these these students of ours, to connect physically, personally, presentially with others. You know, you can be in New York City walking down a street full of strangers, but at the same time, you can imagine that each one of those people has a support system, has people that they can rely on or who are relying on them, who are connected to them, who are making their life, more human. Right? Where the global Internet community, of all the different social media platforms, they can be helpful, but they're not always. Sometimes actually more detrimental than helpful.

37:17Right? I know this has been a little bit of a smattering of of a lot of, of, you know, information. You know, I'm gonna kinda pause here. I imagine there may have been a number of questions that have popped up. I do want to kinda go through and and see, you know, if there are questions or discussion points that that you all would like to bring up. Happy to dive into some of those. Alright? Initially, we looked at, our high school students and the situations that they go through, they find themselves in, college students in the same. Alright? And what are a number of ways, that we can, that we can engage and help them to, break through their loneliness, to identify it, to validate it, to understand it, to grow in an understanding of it, and to advance past it, Break through the isolation, and truly reconnect or connect deeply with others.

38:21Thank you very much. So, Natalia, if there's any questions out there Yes. We we had a question. So thank you, Darren. That was quite informative. A lot of people are interested in the CCMMP, which is a Catholic Christian mental model of the person. It is at the core of all of our programs at Divine Mercy University written by our senior scholars. I did share the link, the Amazon link in the chat box for anyone who is interested. It is quite a thick book, but it has been translated in Spanish and I believe also in Italian. And many universities in their psychology programs are adopting, the CCMMP and at the core, which is the flourishing of an individual. So there is a question. Sarah asked, isn't there a kind of moral isolation for students of faith in secular schools, question mark?

39:30Their peers may seem see them as intolerant, biased, or unloving. Great. Did you say her name was Sarah? Yes. Okay. First off, a quick blurb about the CCMFP, Sarah. Hang on just a second. You know, Natalia, I'm so glad that you mentioned that it is actually the CCMMP, the cat a Catholic what is it? A Catholic Christian meta model of the person. Yes. This is really haven't done a lot of work in the field of of coaching and and direction. I believe this is kind of a first of its kind and and really, having read read through hundreds of different books, this is such a complete version or complete volume to help develop that, vision of the human person, you know, and how to, kind of overarching in the major themes of humanity, give that a true kind of a a harmonizing view.

40:36Crazy enough, you know, you may think that sometimes it may be more isolating Catholic Christian meta model as opposed to all the others. It actually is a way, that brings the fullness of faith and brings the rest of it kind of underneath the umbrella of of true healthy and flourishing humanity. So, really, beautiful volume, very academic. You're gonna want if you're gonna get it, you're gonna want to take it piece by piece, chew slowly, because it really is a it's a beautiful thick, dense, work of of of mastery by some of the the folks from DMU. Okay. So Sarah's question. Can you read it back to me again, please, Natalia? I appreciate it. Yes. Isn't there a kind of moral isolation for students of faith in secular schools, question mark?

41:28Their peers may see them as intolerant, biased, and unloving. Great question. Sarah, thank you very much for asking it too. I'll be honest. I worked at a couple of different state schools, in their campuses, for about four or five years. And it's it's very, it's very personal for each individual, alright, how that actually comes across. Alright? And how, how each person deals within an individual way. I think in from a counseling point of view, it definitely is gonna be something where we help them. We help the individual in the midst of their scenario. Alright? Where, we wanna help them find a healthy way of responding to all the different things happening around them, so that they themselves are healthy.

42:26They're happy. They're flourishing in and of themselves. Right? I think we we don't have to look very far right now, especially in the news and seeing how much stuff is coming at people, how much anger and hatred, how easy it is to kind of create even kind of these isolating pieces. It's I'd say for from what what experience has shown me, especially in college life, this whole idea of finding a a community is going to be paramount. Alright? And that community doesn't have to be a 100 people. Alright? Working on a couple of college campuses in Texas, for example, the funny enough, the the church the the the community that I was working with, they have a humongous, campus ministry for for student life.

43:18Alright? They'd have hundreds couple 100 kids coming to mass every day. And, sometimes even there, it was very hard to get into kind of the the niche or the niches inside of, inside of the community because there were so many. If you were kind of an introverted type of person, you'd see all these other people so joyful and so happy. It's not like you were having to battle for the faith, but it was still hard, to find your group and connect. So I think there, it's it definitely is going to be a piece where, we help each individual identify themselves, what are they looking for in their own friend group, how to, how to come to peace with themselves. And little by little know that, it is going to take time for them to connect.

44:11Right? And some of the other folks, you know, it's it is it's it's very painful, especially coming from our our angle of of healthiness and flourishing when we see all the the aggravation that's out there and the political politically charged, commentary that's everywhere. That kind of is an an that's an unhealthy world to be in already, And we have to help the folks that we can little by little to be solid in themselves, be healthy in themselves, and be able to navigate and know what to engage in and what to avoid. Hope that's helpful. Okay. So Sarah also wrote here, the CCMMP sounds like what JP two did for understanding of Catholic morals. Very true. It very much is a it is kind of like a Catholic go to or like a Catholic Christian vision of the person.

45:13Right? It definitely is very, very much founded in the truths of the church, very scripturally based as well. I'd say probably from a a mental health point of view you know, I I found it very interesting how it was titled. It's a Catholic Christian meta model of the person. You know? It's not it's not, kind of professing itself to be the one and only. Alright? As kind of papal magisterium may. Alright? This is this this is what it is. Alright? But it's saying, hey. Listen. This is trying to take a look at, the world that we live in, our our deep interactions, who we are, what's our identity, and how was man made to grow and flourish. And it uncovers a lot of really beautiful things. So, yes, I mean, definitely, cornerstone of of mental health from a Catholic perspective.

46:09So next question, Darren. This question's coming from Michael. What word would you give to married students with child or children who may feel isolated between the professional married world and the single student life? I think the word that comes to mind is I just kind of try to see where that's coming from a little bit. I think one of the most beautiful things that we have is family. Alright? I think a danger a dangerous word is grasping. Alright? And a healthy word is family. When we find ourselves in the midst of, I'm a married man. You know? I'm working full time, and I'm studying a master's at the same time. Alright? It could be that in the midst of it, we can look at and we can see, what other people have, and we may be comparing ourselves to others.

47:17You know, we may have unhealthy expectations or unhealthy, you know, things that have not necessarily been resolved in us. Alright? But one of the most beautiful things that we do have and as you're mentioning you're married and and you you, or for someone who's married who has who has a child or two or more, it's very I'd say it's very important to actually highlight for them the beauty of what they do have. Alright? Not highlighting the, I don't know, the attractiveness of what they don't have. Right? But actually diving and seeing the beauties of family. Alright? The beauty of of their their their marriage. You know? There may be crosses that are involved. There's there's always some struggles that we have to we have to learn how to endure.

48:07But that family piece is really meant to be a a deep piece of us. You know? As point this point here on the on my, on the slide deck here, it's not good for man to be alone. Alright? We're always in waiting if we're if we're just standing alone. Alright? But in and in that family connection, we have the deepest connections that we can possibly have. Definitely a it's a great question, Michael. You know? And and going through it and finding out you know, doing some deep dive in there too, it may be worthwhile. You know, we have to find out really what are the motivations inside of that person. What are the what's healthy, what's what may not be too healthy? You know, what needs what needs to be, pointed towards flourishing?

49:02So, Darren, it was a two part question. The second part that Michael asked is, or what word would you give to a family with child where the father is studying if he and or his spouse are feeling lonely? You know, what comes to mind and as I pause to think about it, I think one of the most important words right there is going to be discernment. And I say discernment primarily because, we have to as as married men, as married women, we've made we've made a lifelong commitment, a vow to another person. Right? We've we've created a a covenant relationship with our spouse. Right? And it's very possible that things inside of our world are pulling us or pulling at that relationship, whether it's work, it's study, it's money, it's kids.

50:15The idea of discerning really means that of finding what's finding and committing to first things first. Alright? And if there are things that are beginning to create a relationship of loneliness, how can we slow things down or put things at a at a certain at a particular speed that help us break through that loneliness. You know? Studying your masters, if you are studying in college. You know, is there is there a way to slow it down so that your relationship can be first and foremost? Alright? How can we get creative with our job scenario or with our studies themselves or with our kids? Because great man once told me that our kids, for example, and he said even even probably our wives, spell love, t I m e.

51:12So being able to discern how we use that time is going to be, is really going to build instead of create a bot. Alright? Definitely not an easy scenario. Alright? I can only imagine, you know, a couple different scenarios from what you're talking about, but and I'm sure there's hundreds of them, if not thousands of them. And trying to find the the right way of answering that, there's no real one perfect answer. But that's where I think prayerful discernment is going to be kind of the the way that you help navigate, navigate in the midst of all those those, you know, pulling tensions. So Michael says, thank thank you, Darren. Very helpful. Very informative. Thank you. Antoinette asks, what are your thoughts on loneliness in people who can't speak?

52:15And, Joanna, that's a beautiful question. You know? It makes me think of you know, quite honestly, it makes me think of a lot of, sweet friends of mine who are, they tend to be on more on the introverted side. Right? Because one is not having the capacity to be able to speak. Another one is actually kind of another barrier may be, the ability to communicate well. Right? I can imagine that not being able to speak personally, you know, not being able to vocalize, is definitely a powerful, hurdle to be able to get over. You know? One, I think it's, you know, kind of in a in a in a clinical way, helping people realize that they are, they're good. They're full. You know? They're loved. That, perhaps they have they have this one piece of them that's that's not working the way that they would like to or the way it does for others.

53:34But really being able to see themselves with a lot of grace and and a lot of a lot of peace is gonna be very important. Right? Being able to you know, funny you actually mentioned it. One of my sisters in law is she's a she's fluent in sign, because she's she's felt kind of a a call, an internal call, to really feel drawn to, to help kind of create better relationships with folks who who can't speak, who are mute. I think there you know, if there's if there are words to be said, you know, one is is peace. You know? How how to be able to get that get past the loneliness, if there's way for them to be able to come out or find, find community to be able to work with. I think there's generally a lot, different families that I've known who have someone who is, who's unable to speak.

54:36You know, their their family becomes a very important support structure for them. Yeah. It's a very, very unique, very unique question and very unique help. You know? Definitely one not to be, not to be walked past lightly. Wish I had a better answer to that one. Definitely gonna take it to prayer and take a thought on how to how to address that. Thank you. So next question, Darren, is from Elsa Laura. She writes, can parts work in parenthesis, I f s help with loneliness? I am not a master in IFS yet. I've dabbled a little I've studied a little bit or read a little bit about it. From what I have seen, I depending on the the person, it definitely can. You know? Because especially if there are things that are that are keeping the person back from engaging.

55:46Alright? If there are if there are blockers that are really keeping the person from from coming out of themselves, and or better kind of forcing them into this, this self isolation type of stance, alright, to protect themselves perhaps from something or, and being able to speak, healthy words to that, healing and flourishing words to to that individual and to those walkers, those internal, stoppers that may be activated inside of them, is gonna be very important. Oh, yes. You know, being able to address them, and help them find, find peace to be able to come out and and speak, share. I think this is really where in a in a in a clinical relationship, there there can e it can actually be a great place for for that kind of that breaking, or rather not breaking, but the kind of the the bridge building to actually start happening.

56:48Those blockers to be relieved of their of their duties so that the person can actually walk forward peacefully and fully. Thank you, Darren. So other Elsa Laura says, great. Thank you. Antoinette said, loved your answer. Thank you so much. America is asking, Darren, can you go over the rest of the, and then it cut off. So, America, if you could write the remainder. So while I wait for America to write, Patricia writes, guidance for recent college graduates who already have been through the isolation of the pandemic found community once again in college and now as graduates feel isolated yet again. You know, there's a what was your who is who is this Patricia? Yes. Patricia, thanks very much for sharing this because this is a reality.

57:57Okay? It definitely is something that we're gonna come across. We very easily could come across a lot of our young adults. Right? Particular, folks who young people who go away to college, create, you know, create a community there, find their their people, quote, unquote, graduate, move home for a short period of time, get a job, and then have to move somewhere else. Alright? And go once again and create community. Alright? Unfortunately, it's a lot of it really depends on a lot of it's gonna hinge on our own choices. Alright? And how you know, when, you know, taking jobs and where do we go to school, and when we come back, what do we do, and how do we reconnect? You know, to help those help our students, help our our kids or our children, or help our clients even to realize that there's there's kind of this this parabolic curve that happens whenever we start and stop something.

59:00You know, you you start school, which means, you know, if you've gone away to to college, you've kind of cut off perhaps a handful or a number of your your deeper relationships that you had when you were when you were a child at home. Alright? And there's going to be an emotional curve that someone's gonna go through, until they have peacefully landed up on the other side. Okay? They've recreated community. They now have found a new group of of people. They're, you know, hopefully, maybe if they're they're going to church, you know, maybe it's a group that's there. Their morals are aligned. They have some deep connector points that are kind of have filled that void they now find themselves.

59:40Now when they get back up to that point, it's important for them to be able to look backwards and see where they were x amount of weeks, months, years ago. Alright? So that now, here they are. They've graduated and they've moved on. The same type of thing is about to happen. It's a very normal experience. It's a it's a it's a it's a loss experience. Right? When they get when they've gone off to college, they've lost, perhaps the support structure that they had in their, in their childhood. You know? The like I said earlier, the the relationship with parents may change or friends may change. Same type of thing after graduation is gonna happen once more, where this this experience of loss is going to be very present.

1:00:26Alright? Until a certain amount of time is gonna happen, and they're gonna have to, try to go back out there and reconnect with folks around them. But also very important in that factor is to let them know, once again, take your time. Alright? It doesn't all have it's Rome was not built in a day. Allow yourself the peace. Get yourself established. Take your time. Reconnect little by little. You don't have to be in a flood of, of friends. This is I think, honestly, to be, you know, really very clear, this is actually where social media things actually serve sometimes as a detriment. Alright? Because oftentimes, people only place their their happy faces on, on social media. And as, you know, someone that you're mentioning, you know, let's say a young man comes home, all of his friends are off doing great things.

1:01:28At least that's all that he sees. And he has, again, this understanding that everybody's doing great except for me. Little by little, step by step, day by day, one experience, one person, another person. Over time, they're able to recreate a support network. Beautiful thing is if they actually come home and they find a good healthy, support system there that they can reengage in. If they don't, you know, if they move on to somewhere else, little by little. This is where even, like, their their previous relationships will really show themselves also, whether they're parental relationships or or good friends, that they stay in connection with. It'll help them little by little to to overcome and be able to look back and say, okay.

1:02:19I was once there, got up here. It may happen again, but we'll get to the other side soon. Hopefully, that's helpful. So going back to America, what she was asking is if you could go through the rest of the slides because we seem to be on loneliness and lack of social connections. Oh, sorry. Thank you. I apologize. And then next question from Claudia. Will you talk about loneliness during other stages of life another day? For example, loneliness after the empty nest or retirement. You know, it's I don't think it's contemplated for for me to speak about it. Natalia, you would know better. Who are the the the follow-up speakers for this month in particular? And what themes are the what themes are they gonna be talking about?

1:03:19So the next presentation will be on Sunday, May 25, and that will be hosted by doctor Emily Dowdell. She is a PsyD alumna from 2019, and she will actually be addressing loneliness and depression in the wake of COVID nineteen with a spin on how digital communication offered both a source of increased connection and simultaneous isolation. Okay. I don't know if you still wanted to address Claudia's, question, or I can certainly drop in, the chat here the link to register for the upcoming, webinar. Yes. Yeah. Please do. Please drop that in. And can you reread the question one more time then? Because we can we can definitely touch on some of it. That's for sure. Will you talk about loneliness during other stages of life?

1:04:20For example, loneliness after the empty nest or retirement. Great. Well, Claudia, thank you very much for bringing up the question. In reality, loneliness can can hit can hit people at various stages of their life. We've kind of decided to focus in tonight on, young people, on students, both in high school and college or young adulthood. But for real, it actually can hit many people at many different stages. Alright? There's different family scenarios that can that can impact it. Alright? Different, what I've found is that, some folks who have, they've kind of isolated themselves in their adulthood, they often you know, let's say even I'm I'm not even talking about empty nesters yet, you know, but people who have who have stayed as, as single adults for a longer period of time.

1:05:22It's very it's a it's a deep suffering, isolation is, or or rather, loneliness can be. Alright? As we're longing for because we're one of the things that highlight that comes out in the in the, what do you call it, in the the CCMMP is that we are made for connection. Alright? All of us are. All of humanity is made for connection. John Paul the second as well was very clear about that in his in a number of his writings as well that we are made for connection with one another. Right? And in the midst of that, you know, when we find that we are or some of the folks that we work with or that we know and love, they kind of isolate themselves. It's because, you know, oftentimes, it can be because, they're missing something.

1:06:14They're, they wish that they could actually be connected. They wish that they could find a a more full connection, but something stands in the way. And being able to identify that and help kind of bridge those gaps is gonna be, especially for people in our lives that that we know and we love, it's gonna be very important for the long term for them. Alright? When it comes to a different a different stage of life, you mentioned, kind of empty nesters, for example. One of the most important parts there is that, I think of, you know, empty nesters, a lot of times it can hit folks kind of in their, whatever, late forties, early fifties when their kids have just gone off to college. Another age that's that's further down the line is that of elderly, alright, in elder care.

1:07:04Alright, where their families, they rarely see them and, you know, they have dreams about or they they really wonder about, their kids, their grandkids, their great grandkids, and they wish that they could actually see them more. And it's just, either them by themselves or, I even think of the image of I'll be honest, my parents, you know, are 80 years old, and, you know, they live on they live on some acreage down in Indiana. And, they love the one thing that they do is they they love spending time with their kids. It's very important that when we when we work with folks that are like this or that in this type of, of life ages, that we help renew a sense of purpose in their life, alright, and a sense of connection.

1:07:52Something like connecting them to help or helping them connect to to something that is greater than themselves, right, To help bridge that loneliness that may sink in. Right? Whether it's a cause, you know, whether it's other family members, whether it's, a service of some sort that they're offering, whether it's sharing their wisdom, You know? It's going to be very important for us depending on what age they are and and what the things are that are available around them and what is the extent of their family, That we look to motivate them to stay connected, right, or to get connected. You know? This is actually one of those pluses that, technology helped tremendously to help bridge some of those gaps.

1:08:44Right? Where you know, as they're they're looking to connect with their children or their grandkids, you know, we can help get creative with them about calls that they make and how do they make them. I can't tell you how many times I've reinstalled WhatsApp video on my mother's computer so that, she could talk to her grandkids and talk to the rest of us. But it's at the same time, it it definitely has to be, you know, there's so much that we can actually offer from a counseling or, type of, type of venue or type of connection with them, and to motivate them and help them actually make the steps towards those deeper connections or that purpose driven life. Okay. Next question. So Sofia writes, guidance for young college student in the medical field who lost a part time job.

1:09:41She really was looking forward to so dealing with that loss and in the waiting period for a new part time job, hopefully, in the medical field and having trouble finding open ones. Okay. I guess that was just a comment. Susie writes, some diocese have a very strong young adult communities. Two I know of in Madison, Wisconsin and Carmel, Indiana. Luca wrote powerful contemporary presentation. Very, informative. Is it possible to have the slides shared? Luca, that is up to Darren and Marnie. I can certainly share the recording of this presentation in which will be available within the next couple of days. I did share the other link to everyone, and then Sarah asks again, how about the idea that you can be isolated for good reason?

1:10:40And she says, I call mine my Elijah experience. Now there's interesting question, Sarah. Okay. When it comes to, there's kind of in our spirit you've taken it to a spiritual side. Okay. You brought in Elijah, so let's throw a little spiritual piece to it. There is definitely a plus. Very different from isolation. Isolation is already kind of a I wouldn't say it's necessarily a healthy stepping away. Alright? But a different idea out there is solitude. Alright? And especially, you know, an Elijah moment can oftentimes come when someone is looking for direction in life. Okay. What would they do? They'll, they'll go on a, you know, they'll go on a a couple days, of of silent solitude, whether it's hiking in the hills, you know, walking the Camino or just hiking in the mountains, You know?

1:11:46So as to take some some deep prayer time or some deep reflection time, about what they want their life to look like. I'd say on a regular basis, to be quite honest, you know, working with a number of professionals in various fields, for us as individuals, it is important for us all to have on a regular basis, opportunities for silent solitude. Right? Where we reconnect with our purpose. You know, Michael's question beforehand, about loneliness inside of a marriage, for example. Very important. You know, being a being a dad, I find that there's there's oftentimes days where, things get packed so full, you know, from 5AM to 10PM, and beyond if the toddler doesn't wanna go to sleep at ten. I know some of you out there who have your toddlers, you get them in by 07:30.

1:12:46This little one does not go down at 07:30. But, actually, thinking about it, you know, it's you could it can happen sometimes more than not that our days are are full beyond our capacity to deal with them. Alright? Those are the types of moments when it is very important for us to allow ourselves the freedom and allow ourselves the mental space and the spiritual space to be able to tell our ourselves and and maybe our spouse, hey. You know what? I need some silent solitude time. I'm gonna go for I need for the good of us, I'm gonna go take a walk. I'll be back in an hour or so. Right? Or, you know, getting up a little bit earlier in the morning can be taxing on the system. That's for sure. No many who be many many who get up early to be able to do some special things for themselves, to be able to to take care, to do their self health, their their reflection time.

1:13:49You know? But I think that it's very different when you have isolation on one side where I'm there's is there a fear that's that's moving me into that? Is there a concern? Is there a mental health issue that I have to deal with, or that I'm I need to deal with that's actually kind of pushing me or or kind of keeping me from engaging? Another piece, the Elijah moment, is is probably more of like a, it's a it's a healthy solitude focused or silent option, that we embrace, that we in that we we get into so as to be able to help ourselves to grow and develop healthy. Hope that's helpful. And so Sarah wrote, I thought I was alone and in parenthesis, and it was involuntary solitude end parenthesis.

1:14:45And during that time, I found my internal conviction. After that, I met with others who shared them. By then, however, I knew that my convictions were my own. Beautiful. Beautiful. You know, sometimes life actually deals us. It's kind of like, you know, I'm thinking about initially, you know, working with with students. Freshman year in college, for example, is definitely a year that can be, especially for some, it can be kind of an Elijah moment. It can be kind of an involuntary solitude or an in involuntary, isolation, you know, where just because the factors of life have all changed, I haven't had a chance to build my my support system. But in the midst of all that, I actually discover what is is most what is deepest and what is most most real and most important for me.

1:15:39Very common, you know, especially for you know, when I think about those the whatever the the introverted young men and women, oftentimes, they are the ones who have the deepest thoughts. They are the ones who have kind of these Elijah moments, of of great clarity. You know? And once they come out, once they once enough time has kind of passed and they've been able to make touch point relationships here and there, they've decided to make the right relationships, the healthy ones that are gonna help them build their whole support system forward. Great. Glad to hear about it. Thank you, Sarah. And Claudia said I really appreciated this talk, Marnie and Darren. God bless you. And so that completes the questions and the presentation.

1:16:28So I really appreciate everyone taking their time this evening, across the nation to join us, here with Darren and Marnie. Darren, of course, special thank you to you and for Marnie putting this great presentation together and sharing, our campaign of unlock loneliness during the month of May. We really appreciate it. I did add the Zoom link for the upcoming presentation that would be May 25. It does fall on a Sunday. It is with our PsyD alumna, doctor Emily Dowdell, Renee, Victoria, Esther, America. They all say thank you, Darren. Sarah, you are welcome, Sheena. Thanks for me. You are very, very welcome. Thank you for joining us, and stay safe, stay healthy, and may God bless all of you. Thanks to all.

1:17:27God bless you. Thanks so much.